Grades and scores don't mean anything.

jd50ae · September 2014

By Kaitlyn Schallhorn, Campus Reform

A liberal arts college in Maryland is forgoing the traditional application process as it is all about privilege and wealth.

According to José A. Bowen, president of Goucher College, college acceptance is no longer based on merit or academic success in high school. Beginning next year, Goucher will become the first college in the nation to offer students the opportunity to simply submit a two-minute video as the main part of the application process, which will still require the same monetary fee as the traditional application.

"For most Americans, applying to college is a giant mystery. The whole system is broken. Nobody thinks this is a good thing. Its very high-stress. Its all about privilege and wealth."

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Lee.mcglynn · September 2014

Uuuummmmmmm my sister is a teacher...she worked at a very wealthy high school. She was told the lowest grade she could give was a C. We all really know most colleges just want money! Some ei Harvard,princeston and MIT are hard to get into but at the rate where college grads are actually getting jobs in the field they major in well most colleges just are willing to take anyone. It's sad and when or if I become a father my kid ain't going to college...the trades will rule the world and book smarts mean nothing now and never will unless your a teacher

AshMe · September 2014

Lee.mcglynn:
Uuuummmmmmm my sister is a teacher...she worked at a very wealthy high school. She was told the lowest grade she could give was a C. We all really know most colleges just want money! Some ei Harvard,princeston and MIT are hard to get into but at the rate where college grads are actually getting jobs in the field they major in well most colleges just are willing to take anyone. It's sad and when or if I become a father my kid ain't going to college...the trades will rule the world and book smarts mean nothing now and never will unless your a teacher

This is tricky. You can bet your balls that if I was talented and learned a trade from my dad or something, thats all I would be doing. Even if I could be a professional fisherman. Unfortunately, not all of us are that lucky and have to go to school to learn something. I agree, though, that book smarts mean diddly...my brother and I both dropped out of high school (I later went back because I wanted to join the USMC)...but unfortunately, some careers cannot be achieved without college. To name a few, Lawyers need law school, doctors need med school, and CPA's need accounting classes to get licensed. But, I feel the majority of learning is done on-hands and in the field, anyway.

First_Warrior · September 2014

I barely graduated from high school, went into the Marines, went to war, survived, and after a number of years became a professional craftsman. I have had some sucess in my making and taught my craft at various craft schools. The students in my classes were getting college credits for those classes. Life is strange.

The3Stogies · September 2014

Education is yours to take or leave. I can probably say that I have learned more out of school than in school, education should be life long. A good teacher plants the seed for wanting to learn. The usual method of assessment is testing for a grade which shows you know the subject matter. Applying this to the real world is where it gets tricky, I see this at work all the time.

When I went back to college it was with the intention of starting a business so I wanted to learn for myself, not necessarily for the grade. I saw others blowing through their work, getting some good grades but did they really learn and retain much.

matkn293 · September 2014

This is an interesting thread. I agree with many of the points and not here to refute any. I myself, blew through high school playing sports and entertaining women. Same with college. Got by just enough to make the grade and move on. Only classes I put the extra afford were my major classes in drafting and design. This leads me to my point that while a college degree is becoming more necessary as even entry level positions are requiring this. I do not believe it is not the end all, be all for a career. My degree did help me however. It opened the door and have me enough skill to start out with design work for a GC that led to a full time position transitioning into estimating and PM work. After that I started my foray into electrical. This is the who you know part. I knew these guys from working with them at the GC. I knew nothing about electrical but they were willing to teach me because I had a good base with the rest of it (computers, pm work, building, etc). 12 years later out of college I am still learning everyday and yet running 5-8m in electrical projects a year. For me I can't necessarily say that it is just a piece of paper as it led me to where I am today. However, it's what you do with it once you get out and most certainly on the job training is key. You learn more in the first week of a job than you do in a 4 yr degree most times. It is extremely unfortunate that there are institutions out there that are more about class and status of an individual. It almost seems like a social club at times rather than getting someone a base for the future.

perkinke · September 2014

AshMe:
Lee.mcglynn:
Uuuummmmmmm my sister is a teacher...she worked at a very wealthy high school. She was told the lowest grade she could give was a C. We all really know most colleges just want money! Some ei Harvard,princeston and MIT are hard to get into but at the rate where college grads are actually getting jobs in the field they major in well most colleges just are willing to take anyone. It's sad and when or if I become a father my kid ain't going to college...the trades will rule the world and book smarts mean nothing now and never will unless your a teacher
This is tricky. You can bet your balls that if I was talented and learned a trade from my dad or something, thats all I would be doing. Even if I could be a professional fisherman. Unfortunately, not all of us are that lucky and have to go to school to learn something. I agree, though, that book smarts mean diddly...my brother and I both dropped out of high school (I later went back because I wanted to join the USMC)...but unfortunately, some careers cannot be achieved without college. To name a few, Lawyers need law school, doctors need med school, and CPA's need accounting classes to get licensed. But, I feel the majority of learning is done on-hands and in the field, anyway.

I think Ash hit the nail on the head, and it's a change I'm working on in my organization (though being an area dominated by a university there's an elitist attitude when it comes to degrees so I won't be hugely successful). Outside of the "professional positions" (i.e. medical, planners, engineers) we have to train people our way anyway. And frankly, as an administrative person, a coordinator or middle management not many degrees are really going to be of much use, very little of education these days is focused on practical use. My grad school program has proven useful but it was specifically designed to enhance the skills of experienced professionals and taught by people who had distinguished careers THEN got their doctorates (Side note: one professor was the head of the Forest Service region during the nightmare '90's and talked about having to talk a young woman down from a tree while her "friends" were encouraging her to hang herself to make a political point, with the girl's mother on one phone begging him to save her child and international media hounding him to fail so they'd have a good story. Would NEVER have heard that story from a career academnic).

it is frustrating because if you don't have a degree it's almost impossible to get your foot in the door these days, particularly since many organizations use computer programs to do their first round of selections in the hiring process. Yeah it's more efficient, but I'm convinced we lose out on a lot of really great employees because they can't check one certain box.

Gray4lines · September 2014

"Its all about wealth" ... this is referring to the strong link between parents education (and earnings) and childs education. Instead of looking at grades (which is probably closely linked to parents edu and earnings) the video application is supposed to reveal some typically "unobserved" characteristic like motivation, excitment for learning, and creativity. This would arguably give "first generation" college enrollees a better chance since maybe their HS grades were low just because no one in the family really thought school was important.

Could be a cool Idea. In a perfect world, grades would exactly measure ability but clearly a lot more is going on. Tests arent perfect and maybe a kid just isnt motivated before he or she finds something exciting to them.

The world needs all sorts of people and as long as you can find something you love to do, go for it. Lifelong learners will be the ones that come out ontop. College or no, if you are always open to improving at whatever you do, youll be set.

webmost · September 2014

jd50ae:
By Kaitlyn Schallhorn, Campus Reform

A liberal arts college in Maryland is forgoing the traditional application process as it is all about privilege and wealth.

According to José A. Bowen, president of Goucher College, college acceptance is no longer based on merit or academic success in high school. Beginning next year, Goucher will become the first college in the nation to offer students the opportunity to simply submit a two-minute video as the main part of the application process, which will still require the same monetary fee as the traditional application.

"For most Americans, applying to college is a giant mystery. The whole system is broken. Nobody thinks this is a good thing. Its very high-stress. Its all about privilege and wealth."

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Yeah? So what are you going to do with a liberal arts education from Goucher? I'll take a trades apprenticeship any day. You get paid to learn that.

jd50ae · September 2014

I keep reading interviews with "students" from liberal arts (not all) schools and I am amazed and dumbfounded about how little common sense and world knowledge they have. I think the one that struck me the most is when asked about 9/11 they didn't know what happened. I wouldn't want any of these liberal arts "students" working for me any place but the mail room (after a spelling test). Give me and ex-service person or a trade school graduate every time.

pelirrojo · September 2014

First, it is a private school so they can do as they please with their application process.

Second, if you visit Goucher's website there are guidelines for what sort of grades and scores their current student body had upon acceptance to the school. I would venture to say nearly every college in America still has a set of criteria that must be met to be granted acceptance. Think for yourself. Do some research. The video, as Gray stated, may reveal some "intangible" about the applicant that isn't readily visible on a transcript or paper application. This may provide an opportunity to a student who wouldn't have been all that impressive on paper, which I am all for because I was one of those students.

Finally, when I was going through the application process to the school I attended, part of the process was an in person interview with the Dean of the program I intended to study. A video application seems to accomplish that same goal without the hassle of having to schedule hundreds of interviews. Students also don't have to take a day out of school or pay to travel to an interview. Many companies are doing job interviews over skype, facetime, or some other form of digital communication these days as well. This is making it easier for both companies and potential employees to speak to one another and see one another without having to travel to do so. It's just technology making things easier for all parties involved, which isn't scary.

AshMe · September 2014

I took the kids to the book store on saturday and saw this. Made me think of this discussion...

Grades and scores don't mean anything.

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